<html><head><style><![CDATA[#xf49453fc929240f8b90b3f9eaa4f07b7{
font-family:Arial;
font-size:11pt;
}]]></style><style id="css_styles" type="text/css"><!--blockquote.cite { margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px; padding-left: 10px; padding-right:0px; border-left: 1px solid #cccccc }
blockquote.cite2 {margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px; padding-left: 10px; padding-right:0px; border-left: 1px solid #cccccc; margin-top: 3px; padding-top: 0px; }
a img { border: 0px; }
li[style='text-align: center;'], li[style='text-align: right;'] { list-style-position: inside;}
body { font-family: Arial; font-size: 11pt; }--></style></head><body><div>Dear Lars, Jakub and everybody,</div><div>I've to say something, take it serious but take it easy ;-)</div><div><br /></div><div>It's interesting all the last 20 years I found myself in the party of the people being blamed for building not totally straw because I didn't go for load bearing so much. Now some years later all the load bearing people especially all the leading ones in UK, in Denmark, in Spain ... converted to market compromised money earn thinkers. What happend?</div><div><br /></div><div>Somehow ecococon managed to buy some grass roots souls in Europe. Congratulations!</div><div><br /></div><div>For me it's not a matter of fear of competition, not a matter of a factory here and not a matter of the amount of compromises. Not question of who had the idea or whatever you could imagine in that direction.</div><div><br /></div><div>It's a matter of a real sustainable, regional open source solution and to believe that this solution is able to come into market and not the typical way of capitalism globalized behaviour, working with cheap people transporting thousands of kilometer.</div><div><br /></div><div>The idea of straw building is (no matter if load bearing or not): </div><div><br /></div><div>local straw</div><div>local timber</div><div>local other materials like earth and lime if possible</div><div>local crafts men</div><div>local change of society and business structures w i t h all the companies</div><div>everybody can build it with just the material from field, earth, forest</div><div>it's not the handcrafted way of business (which includes real efficient ways of prefab)</div><div><br /></div><div>Solutions like EcoCocon</div><div>no local straw</div><div>no local timber</div><div>no local other material</div><div>no local craftsmen except of a small erecting team for two days for single family house</div><div>no change in local business</div><div>may be everybody could screw the elements together</div><div><div id="xf49453fc929240f8b90b3f9eaa4f07b7"><div><div>it's the industrial way of business </div></div></div></div><div><br /></div><div>Why don't you believe that we can't reach market with that local solution?</div><div><br /></div><div>For me EcoCocon and all the solutions like that is not 103 to 100 compromises it's 103 to maximum 3 compromises I see with building with straw like we mainly do in Germany.</div><div>And we started from beginning with the 3 compromises...</div><div><br /></div><div>FASBA discussed that some years ago and decided to go that way. </div><div><br /></div><div>By the way: I respect everybody who just says I have to do this and that just because of earning money (to a certain point, as long it's not real bad work).</div>
<div><br /></div><div><br /></div><div>Lars and Jakub: Please be sure that you've 100% personal respect from me </div><div>BUT EcoCocon and others are not more than 20% of the straw building idea I thought it is.</div><div><br /></div><div>Sorry for my very broken english today, I'm out of international networking since more than 2 years, focussing on local work ...</div><div><br /></div><div>:-)</div><div><br /></div><div>Dirk</div><div id="signature_old"><div style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"><span id="de091995dbd640a1af22d94621c6a1c0">
<div><span id="59b3adae6c3b4005b70cf8dae9043744">
<div style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"><span id="9b5c6269d4cb41ac875d77ec24feea1d">
<div><font size="2"></font><font face="Arial"> </font></div>
<div><font size="2"><span>
</span></font><div><font size="2"><span id="xd1ee189ebf4945f1808b7ffdb1769f59">
<div><font size="2" face="Arial">--</font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"> </font></div>
</span></font><div id="signature_old"><font size="2">
</font><div><font size="2">
</font><div><font size="2">
</font><div><font size="2"><font size="2"><span id="x852a7cd7e5854bfab1369a7f2ffcc471" class="plain">
<div id="signature_old">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div id="signature_old">
<div>
<div>
<div><font face="Arial">Dirk Scharmer</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial">Fachverband Strohballenbau Deutschland e.V.</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial">Artilleriestr.6</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial">27283 Verden</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial">www.fasba.de</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial">Email: ds@fasba.de</font></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></span></font></font></div></div></div></div></div></div></span></div></span></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"> </font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial">Hinweis: Der Inhalt dieser E-Mail ist vertraulich und ausschließlich für den bezeichneten Adressaten bestimmt. Wenn Sie nicht der vorgesehene Adressat dieser E-Mail sein sollten, setzen Sie sich bitte mit dem Absender per E-Mail oder unter der angegebenen Telefonnummer in Verbindung und vernichten Sie diese E-Mail auf Ihren Speichermedien. </font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"> </font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial">Notice: The information contained in this e-mail is confidential. It is intended solely for the addressee named above. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and destroy this message on any media of yours.</font></div></span></div></div><div><br /></div>
<div>------ Originalnachricht ------</div>
<div>Von: "Jakub Zucha-Wihan" <<a href="mailto:kuba@jakubwihan.com">kuba@jakubwihan.com</a>></div>
<div>An: "Dirk Scharmer- FASBA" <<a href="mailto:ds@fasba.de">ds@fasba.de</a>>; "Larskeller@Gmail. Com" <<a href="mailto:larskeller@gmail.com">larskeller@gmail.com</a>>; "Global Straw Building Network" <<a href="mailto:gsbn@sustainablesources.com">gsbn@sustainablesources.com</a>></div>
<div>Gesendet: 20.06.2018 10:38:02</div>
<div>Betreff: Re: [GSBN] Prefabricated and/or Modular Natural Building Systems</div><div><br /></div>
<div id="x242e1a6d080646e" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;"><blockquote cite="2D5F7D59-4990-496F-A80C-DF17671EBB78@jakubwihan.com" type="cite" class="cite2">
Hi Dirk and Lars, hello Everybody!<div class=""><br class="" /></div><div class="">Great discussion. Thank you.</div><div class=""><br class="" /></div><div class="">I think I am getting a point made by Lars here. Once a grass root visionary in strawbale building starts to see potential in the prefab system, the matter isn’t really a distance, but what matters is acceptance of many compromises within which the prefab comes in.</div><div class=""><br class="" /></div><div class="">As well as Lars I got also involved in EcoCocon, because it is great, readily available product to me and for all the reasons mentioned by Lars previously. But for me especially, one of it’s potentials is possibility of earning my living out of selling it to wide market. It doesn’t really mean that I am going to stop being involved in what I have been involved in since the start of my straw bale career - community driven, cement free, loadbearing, local straw buildings...</div><div class=""><br class="" /></div><div class="">Prefab made by local craftswoman out of local straw and timber is fantastic achievement, so I am getting your point Dirk. I like what you are doing, but it seems to me that you have always been open to accept compromises in order to push straw bale building further within the system. Why is it then you are not able to accept possibility of having a system that is very similar to yours, but a bit different? Perhaps out of 100 compromises that brings German prefab further away from truly natural and sustainable house, EcoCocon requires acceptance of perhaps 103? … for me, it is a matter of pushing your own boundaries. How far - from the truly natural and truly sustainable building are you willing to go? What is your motivation? Would you be more happy, once EcoCocon builds their factory in Germany? Or is there a fear of competition that prefab brings into this discussion?</div><div class=""><br class="" /></div><div class="">Best wishes to all. I am looking forward to hearing from you.</div><div class="">Jakub Zucha-Wihan</div><div class="">(to most people on this list known as Kuba)</div><div class=""><br class="" /></div><div class=""><br class="" /></div><div class=""><br class="" /></div><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On 18 Jun 2018, at 10:45, Dirk Scharmer <<a href="mailto:ds@fasba.de" class="">ds@fasba.de</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline" /><div class=""><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Hey Lars,</div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">we already discussed that in Montargis ... :-|</div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br class="" /></div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">We are currently building a 20 units co-housing project with local straw, local craftsmen and local timber. It works perfectly. Changing the building world starts in front of my door together with all the companies here and not with one company 2.000km away.</div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br class="" /></div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">For me prefab of course is one possibility. But only local. From Lithuania or whereever its not sustainable it does not cover half the ideas behind straw building. For me it's just a small smell of strawbale.</div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br class="" /></div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Lets keep going and discussing!</div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br class="" /></div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Dirk</div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br class="" /></div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""> </div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br class="" /></div><div id="signature_old" style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><div style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Tahoma;" class=""><span id="de091995dbd640a1af22d94621c6a1c0" class=""><div class=""><span id="x59b3adae6c3b4005b70cf8dae9043744" class=""><div style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Tahoma;" class=""><span id="x9b5c6269d4cb41ac875d77ec24feea1d" class=""><div class=""><font size="2" class=""></font><font face="Arial" class=""> </font></div><div class=""><font size="2" class=""><span class=""></span></font><div class=""><font size="2" class=""><span id="xd1ee189ebf4945f1808b7ffdb1769f59" class=""><div class=""><font size="2" face="Arial" class="">--</font></div><div class=""><font size="2" face="Arial" class=""> </font></div></span></font><div id="signature_old" class=""><font size="2" class=""></font><div class=""><font size="2" class=""></font><div class=""><font size="2" class=""></font><div class=""><font size="2" class=""><font size="2" class=""><span id="x852a7cd7e5854bfab1369a7f2ffcc471" class="plain"><div id="signature_old" class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div id="signature_old" class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><font face="Arial" class="">Dirk Scharmer- Architect</font></div><div class=""><div id="xd2cc04f9c37343959a3e8ed2ce2e094a" class=""><div class=""><div id="signature_old" class=""><div style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Tahoma;" class=""><span id="de091995dbd640a1af22d94621c6a1c0" class=""><div class=""><font size="2" face="Arial" class=""><a href="x-msg://5/www.strawbalehouse.de" class="">www.strawbalehouse.de</a></font></div></span></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></span></font></font></div></div></div></div></div></div></span></div></span></div><div class=""><font size="2" face="Arial" class=""> </font></div><div class=""><font size="2" face="Arial" class="">Hinweis: Der Inhalt dieser E-Mail ist vertraulich und ausschließlich für den bezeichneten Adressaten bestimmt. Wenn Sie nicht der vorgesehene Adressat dieser E-Mail sein sollten, setzen Sie sich bitte mit dem Absender per E-Mail oder unter der angegebenen Telefonnummer in Verbindung und vernichten Sie diese E-Mail auf Ihren Speichermedien.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font></div><div class=""><font size="2" face="Arial" class=""> </font></div><div class=""><font size="2" face="Arial" class="">Notice: The information contained in this e-mail is confidential. It is intended solely for the addressee named above. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and destroy this message on any media of yours.</font></div><div class=""><font size="2" face="Arial" class=""></font></div></span></div></div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br class="" /></div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">------ Originalnachricht ------</div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Von: "Lars Keller" <<a href="mailto:larskeller@gmail.com" class="">larskeller@gmail.com</a>></div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">An: "Min Hall" <<a href="mailto:minhall@xnet.co.nz" class="">minhall@xnet.co.nz</a>></div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Cc: "Global Straw Building Network" <<a href="mailto:gsbn@sustainablesources.com" class="">gsbn@sustainablesources.com</a>></div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Gesendet: 16.06.2018 12:00:38</div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Betreff: Re: [GSBN] Prefabricated and/or Modular Natural Building Systems</div><div style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br class="" /></div><div id="x7ea1f3ebc6964f2" style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><blockquote cite="x-msg://5/CAKaOCAd36frGnpduZ7wfDc1G+HdRZ807FdOM9p9ig41vNVT1-g@mail.gmail.com" type="cite" class="cite2" style="margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px; padding-left: 10px; padding-right: 0px; border-left-width: 1px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); margin-top: 3px; padding-top: 0px;"><div dir="auto" class="">The last 4 days we mounted 250m2 of a two storey school project using prefab strawpanels.</div><div dir="auto" class="">2 of us having experience with bale wall raising, the rest of the crew being builders with various backgrounds.</div><div dir="auto" class="">It was amazing to be honest.</div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class="" /></div><div dir="auto" class="">I agree with John that prefab has a big potential to bring our amazing building material out into the more mainstream.</div><div dir="auto" class="">I agree with Bill that it is not ideal to ship the panels 1500kms from Lithuania to Denmark.</div><div dir="auto" class="">Once demand is big enough there will be a new production line further west.</div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class="" /></div><div dir="auto" class="">In reality for us the choice is not local straw bales or distant straw panels.</div><div dir="auto" class="">It is straw panels or not straw.</div><div dir="auto" class="">Almost all building materials are being trucked to Denmark from afar in the commercial building sector.</div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class="" /></div><div dir="auto" class="">Best, Lars</div><div dir="auto" class=""><br class="" /></div>--<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="" /><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">--<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="" />Small Planet<br class="" />Om vores firma ~ link<br class="" />Om vores masseovne ~ link<br class="" />Om vores workshops ~ link<br class="" />Kontakt-info<br class="" />skype<br class="" />jomorandin<br class="" />lars.friland<br class="" /><a href="mailto:jomorandin@gmail.com" class="">jomorandin@gmail.com</a><br class="" /><a href="mailto:larskeller@gmail.com" class="">larskeller@gmail.com</a><br class="" /><br class="" />Home +45 8668 0505<br class="" />Jo +45 2390 0924 (mobile/handy)<br class="" />Lars +45 2024 0505 (mobile/handy)<br class="" /><br class="" />Jo Morandin, Jamilla, Asger & Lars Keller<br class="" />Friland 12 B<br class="" />8410 Rønde<br class="" />Danmark<br class="" />---</div></blockquote></div><span style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">_______________________________________________</span><br style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="" /><span style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">Gsbn mailing list</span><br style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="" /><a href="mailto:Gsbn@sustainablesources.com" style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Gsbn@sustainablesources.com</a><br style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="" /><a href="http://sustainablesources.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/gsbn" style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">http://sustainablesources.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/gsbn</a></div></blockquote></div><br class="" /></blockquote></div>
</body></html>