<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto">Well said John, I will add a little to what you wrote. When it comes to panels, the method evolved by the Lithuanians, Slovakians (Bjørn Kierulf), etc has a lot to recommend and addresses a variety of concerns that have been voiced. I’ll leave it at that for the moment.<br><br><div id="AppleMailSignature">Sent from my iPhone</div><div><br>On May 18, 2018, at 9:56 AM, John Swearingen <<a href="mailto:jswearingen@skillful-means.com">jswearingen@skillful-means.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div dir="ltr">Enga, you've well expressed the contradictions inherent in blending strawbale, an efficient 'vernacular' system with conventional construction, a highly optimized 'industrial' system. Covering bales with cladding and fitting them to studs impedes the efficiency of wood framing and reduces the bale component to mere insulation, ignoring potential structural and architectural value. The principle advantage becomes that we've stuffed a fair amount of carbon into the walls and can call the building "green".<div><br></div><div><div>Strawbale has an advantage over other vernacular methods in (1) its structural qualities as a ductile, load-bearing material that can take a variety of finishes that provide (2) thermal mass, combined with (3) high insulation. When structural requirements override what bales can provide, it often appears reasonable to install a discrete structural system. Economic constraints and the labor pool can then drive the search for readily accessible and efficient structural systems, such as conventional stud construction, something everybody knows how to do. The same considerations can carry over to the finish material, and thermal mass is sacrificed in order to use efficient and inexpensive sheet goods. </div></div><div><br></div><div>There are some good reasons to do this--using simple frame construction allows people to easily find conventional builders to build their dream. Sheet cladding is attractive in areas where render is uncommon and may be expensive. We learned early on that it was easier to adapt our bales to the framing than to frustrate framers by making them work around the bales. </div><div><br></div><div>A major cost of bale construction comes in the installation and preparation of the bales, particularly around fenestration. This is often discounted because of volunteer labor, but to make bale construction more widely available we've concentrated efforts on improving that aspect of construction, using pre-assembled panels that deliver bales efficiently and still provide structural capability. A standardized panel makes bales more acceptable to mainstream builders, and shop-built panels that contain windows and doors improve qualitiy and lower costs. Separating fenestration from bales into conventionally framed sections, and allows us to use assemblies that were designed for conventional construction without modification--and lets bales be bales.</div><div><br></div><div>John "Panelhead" Swearingen</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr">On Tue, May 15, 2018 at 6:02 PM Enga Lokey <<a href="mailto:enga@thelokeys.net" target="_blank">enga@thelokeys.net</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div style="word-wrap:break-word"><br>Hello you amazing builders/designers,<div><br></div><div>At the risk of being chucked off the list for this question, I would like to play devil’s advocate here and ask what is being achieved by the use of strawbales in the methods discussed below and others that seem to be the direction that strawbale is moving (i.e. building wrap, 2x6 framing on 24in centers, external timber sheathing, etc). More specifically, it appears that the building methods are being adjusted toward a more standard construction to the point of wondering why the strawbale is even still used? There are other cellulose based products and other more natural or healthy insulation products on the market. </div><div><br></div><div>We are all aware of the challenges of working with straw and thus there needs to be, in balance, a greater benefit in order to justify. Is that benefit still there when used in this way? Are we not using equal/more other materials in order to build with straw in these methods? Is it justified? </div><div><br></div><div>And as the saying goes, "just because I am confused does not mean you are incorrect."</div><div><br></div><div>Cheers,</div><div>Enga</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div><span class="m_7071972148771785632m_-1381565801112898242Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse:separate;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Helvetica;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-align:-webkit-auto;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><span class="m_7071972148771785632m_-1381565801112898242Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse:separate;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Helvetica;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><div style="word-wrap:break-word"><span class="m_7071972148771785632m_-1381565801112898242Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse:separate;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><div style="word-wrap:break-word"><div><div><a href="mailto:enga@thelokeys.net" target="_blank">enga@thelokeys.net</a></div></div><div><br></div></div></span><br class="m_7071972148771785632m_-1381565801112898242Apple-interchange-newline"></div></span><br class="m_7071972148771785632m_-1381565801112898242Apple-interchange-newline"></span><br class="m_7071972148771785632m_-1381565801112898242Apple-interchange-newline">
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<br><div><blockquote type="cite"><div>On 15 May 2018, at 9:21 pm, Rene Dalmeijer <<a href="mailto:rdalmeij@mac.com" target="_blank">rdalmeij@mac.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="m_7071972148771785632m_-1381565801112898242Apple-interchange-newline"><div><div>Doug,<br><br>I did a pre-fab 5 story SB build akin to the system used by David in 2007. The difference being we used Fermacell with breathable housewrap on the outside clad with open horizontal larch cladding. This has been performing very well even though there have been some leeks due to caulking problems in the window frames, No mushy bales.<br><br>This has become my preferred Pre-fab SB method. Although I am now involved in a pre-fab build without any earth plaster on the bales at all, shudder! The bales will vertically stacked in prefab elements with underlayment inner and outer skins with wooden vertical slab siding.<br><br><br>Rene Dalmeijer Proces Advies<br>Thomas Hoodstraat 2<br>1086 WE Amsterdam<br><br>06 48955419<br><br>KvK 34243755<br>BTW NL057444146B01<br>NL18ASNB0932817343 <br>new email <a href="mailto:rdalmeij@mac.com" target="_blank">rdalmeij@mac.com</a><br><br>IBAN NL09INGB0004388720<br>BIC INGBNL2A<br><br><blockquote type="cite">On May14, 2018, at 18:42, David Arkin, AIA <<a href="mailto:david@arkintilt.com" target="_blank">david@arkintilt.com</a>> wrote:<br><br>Hello Doug:<br><br>We completed a recent project using a ‘Hybrid Wall System’, employing typical 2x6 studs at 24” on center with plywood sheathing (note - plywood, not OSB - but in a non-seismic zone wood fiberboard or similar may suffice), and then installed the bales as insulation on-end between the studs, using clay plaster on the interior and a typical weather-barrier and cladding finish on the exterior. Attached is an illustration of the system, and here are links to the workshop and the finished building, a 34,000 mixed use office and warehouse in Eugene, Oregon. <br><br><a href="http://www.arkintilt.com/ata-helps-host-casba-hybrid-straw-bale-workshop-our-mahonia-building-eugene-oregon" target="_blank">http://www.arkintilt.com/ata-helps-host-casba-hybrid-straw-bale-workshop-our-mahonia-building-eugene-oregon</a> <br><br><a href="http://www.arkintilt.com/salvaged-materials-mahonia" target="_blank">http://www.arkintilt.com/salvaged-materials-mahonia</a><br><br>Also attached is a picture of the wall under construction. We used 3-string rye bales and held them tight to the plywood with 4” wide strips of 1/2” plywood, and 12” Timber-Hex screws into the studs (we'll use 14” screws next time - easier to find the studs, and a better connection). <br><br>I also have the WUFI analysis our building efficiency consultant ran for various locations - they can run a weather file specific to Wilmington if you wish. LMK.<br><br>This is not quite a ‘StrawCell’ as it doesn’t feature cellulose, but it could be appropriate to Delaware. <br><br>Looks like a great project, <br><br>David / ATA & CASBA<br><br><2017-0224 YW2 bale corner detail2.jpg><br><IMG_9936.JPG><br><blockquote type="cite">On May 14, 2018, at 8:47 AM, Chris Magwood <<a href="mailto:chris@endeavourcentre.org" target="_blank">chris@endeavourcentre.org</a>> wrote:<br><br>Hi Doug,<br><br>Here's a detail from our last straw-cell project. Hope it's helpful to you. You can contact me off list if you want to discuss it.<br><br>Cheers,<br><br>Chris<br><br>On 2018-05-14 11:03 AM, douglas nichols wrote:<br><blockquote type="cite">Hello All<br><br>I'm consulting with a non-profit (<a href="http://www.yinnovations.org/" target="_blank">http://www.yinnovations.org/</a>) to build an affordable straw home for a low income family. Their current engineering was provided by someone unfamiliar with straw bale building and is coming up pretty short of being a low carbon, sustainable, or natural design. So we are moving to a straw cell design to help ease any engineering and building official concerns about the straw bale part. My question is-- does anyone have a good straw cell wall detail drawing they can point me to or donate to the effort?<br><br>Y Innovations, Inc.<br><a href="http://www.yinnovations.org" target="_blank">www.yinnovations.org</a><br>2903 North Jefferson Street 2903 North Jefferson Street is a 4500 square foot vacant lot in the city of Wilmington, where Y Innovations will be completing a 630 square foot naturally-built straw bale home in 2018.<br>Thanks<br><br>Doug Nichols<br><br>Creating Energy Efficient Homes Since 1995<br><br>Nichols Contracting LLC<br>821 S. 400 E.<br>Moab, Utah 84532<br>Cell #<a href="tel:(970)%20683-1517" value="+19706831517" target="_blank">970.683.1517</a><br>Lic. #9508518-5501<br><br>Principal / Qualifying Builder <br>Community Rebuilds Moab -- <a href="http://www.communityrebuilds.org/" target="_blank">http://www.communityrebuilds.org/</a><br><br><br><br>_______________________________________________<br>Gsbn mailing list<br><br><a href="mailto:Gsbn@sustainablesources.com" target="_blank">Gsbn@sustainablesources.com</a><br><a href="http://sustainablesources.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/gsbn" target="_blank">http://sustainablesources.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/gsbn</a><br></blockquote><br>-- <br>Chris Magwood<br>Director, Endeavour Centre<br><br><a href="http://www.endeavourcentre.org" target="_blank">www.endeavourcentre.org</a><br><Screen Shot 2018-05-14 at 11.29.45 AM.png>_______________________________________________<br>Gsbn mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Gsbn@sustainablesources.com" target="_blank">Gsbn@sustainablesources.com</a><br><a href="http://sustainablesources.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/gsbn" target="_blank">http://sustainablesources.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/gsbn</a><br></blockquote><br><br><br>* * * * *<br>Arkin Tilt Architects<br>Ecological Planning & Design<br>1101 8th St. #180, Berkeley, CA 94710<br><a href="tel:(510)%20528-9830" value="+15105289830" target="_blank">510/528-9830 ext. 2#</a><br><a href="http://www.arkintilt.com" target="_blank">www.arkintilt.com</a><br><br>David Arkin, AIA, Architect<br>LEED Accredited Professional<br>CA #C22459/NV #5030<br><br>Director, California Straw Building Association<br><a href="http://www.strawbuilding.org" target="_blank">www.strawbuilding.org</a><br>CASBA is a project of the Tides Center<br><br>"There is no way to peace. Peace is the way."<br>— A. J. Muste <br><br><br><br><br><br><br>_______________________________________________<br>Gsbn mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Gsbn@sustainablesources.com" target="_blank">Gsbn@sustainablesources.com</a><br><a href="http://sustainablesources.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/gsbn" target="_blank">http://sustainablesources.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/gsbn</a><br></blockquote><br>_______________________________________________<br>Gsbn mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Gsbn@sustainablesources.com" target="_blank">Gsbn@sustainablesources.com</a><br><a href="http://sustainablesources.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/gsbn" target="_blank">http://sustainablesources.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/gsbn</a><br></div></div></blockquote></div><br></div></div>_______________________________________________<br>
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