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<DIV>"<EM>For my money, sustainability is an "attitude" that precedes anything
else</EM>." Graeme North</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Reminds me of a great quote from Malcolm Wells in
Gentle Architecture, discussing water-saving shower heads (off-topic - but
related in the area of conservation of resources).</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>"A waster with a gadget is still a waster; a shower
taken by a saver is efficient regardless of nozzle type. The only water-saving
shower head worth having is the one between the ears. That's where all real
savings begin.".</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Feile</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
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<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=graeme@ecodesign.co.nz href="mailto:graeme@ecodesign.co.nz">Graeme
North</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=GSBN@sustainablesources.com
href="mailto:GSBN@sustainablesources.com">Global Straw Building Network</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, March 20, 2013 4:34
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [GSBN] Can bale buildings be
air tight?- How to ventilate</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>Thanks Derek - I do work on the assumption that waking up alive
beats the alternative but yes, I recognise that there are prejudices and
suppositions involved there - ones I don't intend to apologise for.
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>And indeed there are instances where highly insulated and air-sealed
surroundings have killed. Think of the tragedy when people - often kids
- get trapped inside an old fridge or freezer. Not quite a house I
agree, but some houses seem to be heading in that direction. The slang
term for polystyrene clad houses here is "chilly bin" houses. ("Chilly bins"
are those handy portable polystyrene containers we use to keep picnic stuff
cold in). When these houses incorporate air-sealed windows and doors,
have very limited air changes, and are full of toxic materials and
furnishings, they give a rather unhealthy environment. </DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>I do agree that energy use needs careful attention, very much so, but
also our ability to interact with our natural environment needs careful
conservation. I for one, do not wish to inhabit some kind of perfectly
controlled machine, one that used to be called a house, that delivers
perfectly homogenised living conditions 24 hours a day. Variation in
temperature and humidity is perfectly acceptable within quite a range, as we
all know. Moderating the extremes does make for better comfort, and
health, and its what we aim for I hope. Some technology can be
appropriate here, especially if it is appropriate technology, but
we do not need every room in an oversized, overstuffed, house to be a
consistent 21deg C. There seems to be a growing fear of the outdoors
and all the dangers that lurk therein. We live on a spaceship called
Earth, and not on a rocket to Mars.</DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Yes I agree that unsafe and unsanitary housing adversely affects far too
many people, and certainly contributes to some avoidable
illnesses. </DIV>
<DIV>How to improve this situation without costing the earth is an interesting
topic that exercises many of us, and as Derek says, the solutions will require
knowledge, understanding and attention to details. Hence the rich
value of these discussions, and the value of this network.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>But I also think that mental approach has a large part to play. For my
money, sustainability is an "attitude" that precedes anything else. What
I don't like is a resource-rich approach that mimics, far too much for my
liking, the notion that if something isn't working, then you are not throwing
enough technology (read "brute force") at it. </DIV>
<DIV>And there is always Jevon's Paradox to come into play, just when you
think you are on to something.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Cheers</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Graeme </DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR>
<DIV>
<DIV>On 16/03/2013, at 3:17 AM, Derek Stearns Roff <<A
href="mailto:derek@unm.edu">derek@unm.edu</A>> wrote:</DIV><BR
class=Apple-interchange-newline>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV
style="WORD-WRAP: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space">
<DIV>I'm in partial agreement with Graeme, and I appreciate his comments.
I'm opposed to waking up dead from any cause, although I admit that
this reflects prejudice and supposition in my case, since I have never tried
it. But I think we need to be careful of false dichotomies, spurious
connections, and wishful thinking. </DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>I advocate healthy buildings and a healthy world, and I suspect
everyone on this list would say the same. I advocate connection with
the natural world, while preferring to sleep in a healthy natural house,
rather than spending my life in the much more natural state of our ancestors
100,000 years ago. I don't have the skills needed to survive as humans
did deep in prehistory, nor do I have the community and habitat to support
that lifestyle. Like most of us, I am striving to understand the best
balances and combinations between old and new. </DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>I think it is a false dichotomy if we equate tight houses with health
risks and leaky houses with health. How many cases can we document, of
people who have woken up dead because the mechanical ventilation system in
their tight house failed overnight? Around here, the people who are
killed by their houses each winter live in leaky houses, with bad wood
stoves or fossil fuel furnaces. Most of the people with chronic
home-induced health problems don't live in well-designed tight houses,
rather they live in average to leaky homes, with compromised heating and
coolings systems, mold, toxic materials, and ventilation problems.
Having random leaks does not guarantee good ventilation, nor good
indoor air quality. Neither does having a mechanical ventilation
system. Creating a healthy house requires knowledge, understanding,
and attention to many details. </DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Derek</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><SPAN style="BORDER-SPACING: 0px; BORDER-COLLAPSE: separate"
class=Apple-style-span>Derek Roff<BR><A
href="mailto:derek@unm.edu">derek@unm.edu</A><BR><BR></SPAN></DIV>On Mar 14,
2013, at 3:51 PM, Graeme North <<A
href="mailto:graeme@ecodesign.co.nz">graeme@ecodesign.co.nz</A>>
wrote:<BR><FONT class=Apple-style-span color=#144fae><BR></FONT>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV
style="WORD-WRAP: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space">
<DIV>Well my 2c worth is that in NZ we have a long history of cold damp
houses, in a very humid mostly temperate climate. (As it is at the
moment we are in the grip of the worst drought for over 70 years so any
hint of damp would be welcome.)<BR><FONT class=Apple-style-span
color=#006312><BR></FONT>That aside - the best strategy I have found for
drying out damp houses is to use hygroscopic materials in the fabric of
the house - and the best and easiest is earthen walls or at least earthen
plasters on any suitable substrate such as dry wall. Of course to
help get over cold we insulate and that's where sheep's wool, or
strawbale, or low density earthen materials, come into their own.
Condensation on windows and the accompanying wet window sill
syndrome simply vanishes. Needless to say we don't have several cm
of snow lying around but we do get some pretty good frosts. Then
reducing the size of houses and the size of windows in them also helps.
Lets face it, oversized badly orientated triple or quadruple glazed self
ventilating thermally broken windows are still not nearly as good as a bit
of well insulated wall at keeping heat in or out. <BR><FONT
class=Apple-style-span color=#006312><BR></FONT>I suggest that the
approach of using more and more of the earth's resources to sort out these
building issues may not be a good primary design strategy,
especially when it leads to oversize buildings, with oversized windows
needing mechanical ventilation systems etc., - mechanical systems
that are only as good as their energy supply. I don't want to wake
up dead of asphyxiation in an air tight building because the electricity
failed while I slept.<BR><FONT class=Apple-style-span color=#006312 size=4
face=Arial><I><BR></I></FONT>This is not to dismiss some very good
building science and its associated research, but I am finding this
conversation on interior air quality in air tight buildings a bit
disturbing when we end up with buildings so tightly sealed that the
occupants are at risk from either the building fabric itself, or even more
alarming, from their own breathing! People would be much healthier
outside the building under these circumstances. Interesting, isn't
it, how, if a person feels ill we often take them outside, where they
usually feel much better? We really do need protection from the
built environment. <BR><FONT class=Apple-style-span
color=#006312><BR></FONT>I prefer a design approach that minimises the use
of expensive, resource gobbling, and complicated materials and systems.
A colleague of mine sums it up thus:<BR><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: Arial" class=Apple-style-span><I>The.... division
is between those who fling open their doors to embrace the day, and those
who huddle behind triple glazing worrying whether they are going to be
comfortable</I><I style="FONT-SIZE: large">. </I><FONT
size=2>Tony Watkins FNZIA </FONT></SPAN><BR><FONT
class=Apple-style-span color=#006312><BR><BR><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"
class=Apple-style-span><BR></SPAN></FONT><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"
class=Apple-style-span>Graeme "Stirrer"</SPAN><BR><FONT
class=Apple-style-span color=#006312><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"
class=Apple-style-span><BR></SPAN></FONT><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"
class=Apple-style-span>Graeme North Architects</SPAN><BR><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px" class=Apple-style-span>49 Matthew
Road</SPAN><BR><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"
class=Apple-style-span>RD1</SPAN><BR><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"
class=Apple-style-span>Warkworth 0981</SPAN><BR><FONT
class=Apple-style-span color=#006312><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"
class=Apple-style-span><BR></SPAN></FONT>
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