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Chris, you raise many great questions, by way of investigation,
sharing, and being downright helpful. Stepping back from the
details of how to deal with the bales, what to replace them with,
etc., I am curious - do other wall systems in the area incur similar
damage? What do other homes look like? Are those who live in
wood-framed homes with drywall and insulation replacing the lowest
0.9m of drywall and insulation? How about the concrete homes? Are
they replacing the lower 2 feet of plaster (interior,exterior)? <br>
<br>
I am interested in how the level of damage and necessary remediation
is for others who live in different types of structures that
survived and are reparable. Am morbidly curious for many reasons...<br>
<br>
Can you give us an idea of what others are doing under similar
circumstances?<br>
<br>
Jeff<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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On 2/5/11 11:46 AM, Chris Newton wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:EE5BCFC29BD54B49A2318FE5B14B0048@HomePC"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div style="font-family: 'Arial'; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);
font-size: 10pt;">
<div>Thanks guys</div>
<div>Thanks Guys</div>
<div> </div>
<div>I had a look at an informative site last night on what
the Aussies are doing with perlite and vermiculite <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
title="http://www.australianperlite.com/perlite-concrete.htm"
href="http://www.australianperlite.com/perlite-concrete.htm">http://www.australianperlite.com/perlite-concrete.htm</a>.
Great products – though if you look at the EE – all that
vermiculite has to be imported from the Kiwi’s and the
perlite from another couple of thousand KMs south. </div>
<div>Emerald is beyond the black stump. Once upon a time they
had a lot of precious stones. Now they have a big dam with
lots of cotton, wheat, oranges. (all gone with the the big
wet and not durable for the future). The town is thriving
between the cotton and coal industry. Everything gets
trained in/out. Brisbane is 1000km from there. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>I guess the biggest issue for us are</div>
<div>1.. we need a product that will withstand the flood
conditions that this building has just been through. ie
bottom bales in water for 3 days, second bales in water for
1 day. As much as all us wished to be able to use straw
again, the evidence from monitoring the walls for 1 month
was overwhelming. The straw was rotting. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>2.. our stake holders included local council, Qld
Tourism, insurer, engineer, builder etc we needed to give
them the confidence that the solution was long term /
climate change friendly. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>3.. It needs to be able to do the job the bottom 2 rows
were doing – supporting the non load bearing walls, and its
render, insulation, aesthetics.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>4... Then we looked at options that were achievable from
an engineering point of view. Colin is standing behind me
wanting to know how you pour this product into some
framework 2 bales high while supporting the SB walls above?
These are great option for ground up construction (along
with those lovely mussel shells), but is going to be a bit
of a brain teaser for restoration work. Though we open to
here how if your miles ahead and were missing something
obvious. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>Colin tells me that it will be a bit of trial an error,
that is why he will be on site with the builders from the
go. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>My understanding is that they are thinking of leaving the
external wall of lime intact. A few extra expansion joints
before work starts.</div>
<div>Working segment at a time.<br>
Breaking some holes through the width of the wall using
Lance’s coring piece.</div>
<div>Placing beams through these which will be supported by
jacks. </div>
<div>Removal of straw below (still leaving that lime on the
external surface)</div>
<div>Having the light weight blocks to work into this space
will be beneficial – there are threaded rods at 900mm
centres, some tie down wires, low window sills, doors etc to
work around. The benefit of the super insulation EPS blocks
is the fact that it is super light weight, cheap, engineered
for the load, can take on a curved form where needed, and
can be worked into this space in a timely manner. </div>
<div>Patch render, make finish good, go home. </div>
<div>We’re not worried about those little termites. We have
them everywhere in Qld, doing what termites do. We construct
to stop the problem at slab level – end of story. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>Chris</div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div style="font-style: normal; display: inline; font-family:
'Calibri'; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: small;
font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none;">
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<div> </div>
<div style="background: none repeat scroll 0% 0% rgb(245,
245, 245);">
<div style=""><b>From:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
title="klerner@one-world-design.com"
href="mailto:klerner@one-world-design.com">Kelly
Lerner</a> </div>
<div><b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 04, 2011 9:56 PM</div>
<div><b>To:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
title="ArchiLogic@yahoo.ca"
href="mailto:ArchiLogic@yahoo.ca">ArchiLogic@yahoo.ca</a>
; <a moz-do-not-send="true"
title="GSBN@greenbuilder.com"
href="mailto:GSBN@greenbuilder.com">(private, with
public archives) Global Straw Building Network</a> </div>
<div><b>Cc:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
title="sb-r-us@yahoogroups.com"
href="mailto:sb-r-us@yahoogroups.com">SB Yahoos</a>
</div>
<div><b>Subject:</b> Re: [GSBN] Emerald update (GSBN
Digest, Vol 33, Issue 17)</div>
</div>
</div>
<div> </div>
</div>
<div style="font-style: normal; display: inline; font-family:
'Calibri'; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: small;
font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none;">My (late) two
cent's worth to add to RT's thoughts on EPS under bales.
<div>
<div> </div>
<div>I agree that EPS is overkill in terms of insulation
and has the added problems of possibly creating moisture
issues and is loaded with fire retardant (in addition to
the issues of global warming potential, susceptibility
to insect attack, high embodied energy, etc). </div>
<div> </div>
<div>I'm moving towards using compacted perlite as
under-slab insulation in Spokane, WA. I wonder if you
have any natural, mineral based material like perlite or
pumice locally available? If so, you might want to check
it out. Just a thought. We used a cavity brick wall
filled with pumice-like coal slag as an insulated wall
at the base of strawbale walls in northern China. Not
perfect, but locally available and a good moisture
resistant wall base under strawbale walls. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>Thanks for sharing so much of your process. Huge gift
to the SB community!</div>
<div> </div>
<div>
<div>
<div>On Jan 27, 2011, at 11:22 PM, RT wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>On Thu, 27 Jan 2011 13:00:03 -0500, <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:gsbn-request@greenbuilder.com">gsbn-request@greenbuilder.com</a>>
wrote:><br>
<blockquote type="cite">Message: 1<br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">on Thu, 27 Jan 2011
09:21:17 +1000<br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">"Chris Newton" wrote:<br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">Re: Fw: Emerald update<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">Currently we plan to
replace [all of the flood-damaged bales] with
engineered high density expanded polystyrene
foam blocks.<br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite"><br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">Of course we are really
interested in any other greener product out
there that will meet the needs, we have a few
months up our sleeve to explore and experiment.<br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite"><br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite">I guess we are now looking
at replacing 2 layers of bales around the whole
building. I hear conversations between Lance and
Col about supporting the upper bales in various
ways while the damaged bales are removed, and
having to put a new capillary layer on top of
the expanding foam.<br>
</blockquote>
[snip]<br>
<br>
(for full text of message/thread, see<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://greenbuilder.com/pipermail/gsbn/2011q1/001252.html">http://greenbuilder.com/pipermail/gsbn/2011q1/001252.html</a>
)<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div> </div>
<div><span style="widows: 2; text-transform: none;
text-indent: 0px; border-collapse: separate; font:
medium helvetica; white-space: normal; orphans: 2;
letter-spacing: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);
word-spacing: 0px;" class="Apple-style-span">
<div>Kelly Lerner, Architect</div>
<div>One World Design Architecture</div>
<div>509-838-8812</div>
<div><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.one-world-design.com">www.one-world-design.com</a></div>
<div> </div>
<div>Have you read Natural Remodeling for the
Not-So-Green House? Available in Bookstores across
the Universe. </div>
<div><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.naturalremodeling.com">www.naturalremodeling.com</a></div>
<div> </div>
</span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
</div>
<div> </div>
</div>
</div>
<p>
</p>
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